Dale Yu: Games for Seven Players or More
Over the next few weeks (well, maybe months), I’ll be going over games that I think are good for certain numbers of players. I think that most of us have a mental list of games that we like to fall back on when there are X people left at a game night. My lists are certainly not universal, but they work for me! I’ll be interested to see which games are on other people’s lists as well! I’ll try to winnow the list to the five games that I prefer most for a specific number. I’ll also likely be able to include an Age of Steam variant (my all-time #1 or #1A game) which I like for that number…
In this first installment, I’ll look at games that I think play well for seven or more players in a single game. In following weeks, I’ll tackle other numbers or arrangements of players.
I must admit that when I compiled this list, I strongly felt that if there are seven or more people, I’d much rather play two separate games than one large game! To me, either larger games end up taking WAY too long or each player ends up with too much downtime between turns. However, there are still some games I prefer to play when put in the situation of a group game…
Games I Like With Seven or More Players
1. Age of Steam: Netherlands
Just the idea of an Age of Steam game that plays seven sounds like madness! It gets worse when you find the board and realize that the whole thing fits on a single 8.5x11” page! The reason that it all fits on a single page is that the goods cubes are placed on a separate map AND you don’t use a lot of regular track tiles. Much of the track in the game is represented with your circular wooden marker alone. I’ve never played the game with less than the full complement of seven, but it’s a tight affair (as you can imagine) with lots of jostling for track and connections! Despite the increased number of players, the game still comes in around 90 minutes which isn’t bad for any version of Age of Steam! If you’re a fan of AoS, I’d highly recommend trying this at least once!
2. Fische Fluppen Frikadellen (FFF)
FFF is one of my favorite economic/market games. It plays really well as a five-player game. However, if you are able to round up enough players (and copies of the game), you can play a three-board version that handles up to 15 players in a single game! Though I really like the single game, I think that it can shine in this multi-board format. Essentially, there are three separate games set up, and one of your options on your turn is to move to another board, bringing all of your money and goods with you. Each board has its own commodity market and corresponding values so the crux of the game is figuring out how to maximize your trading—perhaps buying Fennel on one board at a song, then rushing to another board to sell it high. Of course, everyone else has the same opportunity, so there is plenty of tension in the race to get to a certain place. When you move to a new board, you end up last in turn order, so you need to carefully plan when you’re going to leave. But the race aspect (against as many as fourteen opponents) makes the game a wonderful experience.
If there is a downside to this multi-board game, it’s that there is a pressure for players to take their turns rapidly as there is a real-time-strategy aspect to the multi-board version. If someone at your board is playing slow, everyone at that board is at a slight disadvantage because it takes longer for their turn to come around.
3. Kaleidos
Kaleidos is one of those games that has been devilishly hard to find as of late. It has been called by many more of an activity than a game—and I have to admit that I agree with that sentiment. However, it’s still a pleasure to pull this out and spend an hour with friends playing the game.
Kaleidos is a picture finding game. There are four sets of twelve complex pictures, pictures that have hundreds of different objects in the frame. In a given round, all the players use the same picture. A letter of the alphabet is chosen, a timer is started, and each player looks at the picture—such as the inside of a toy store—and tries to find pictures of words that start with the chosen letter. At the end of the time, players compare answers Boggle-style and you theoretically score points for each unique object that you were able to find. However, most times when we play Kaleidos, it’s more for the amusing (or hilarious) descriptions and rationalizations of why certain parts of the picture can be used to describe something that starts with the appointed letter!
4. Tsuro
Tsuro is a nicely produced entry game in my book. It handles up to eight players, is taught in less than a minute, and takes less than 10 minutes to play. The gameplay is simple: Stay alive as long as possible. Your marker starts on the edge of the board, and each turn, you play a tile in front of your piece. Each tile has an arrangement of paths and after you place the tile, you move your piece along the path that it is on. Your goal is to be the last person able to remain on the board. Great for an opener or filler when you have a large group.
5. World Cup Tournament Football
WCTF is an oldie-but-goodie in my book. The original version was a bit hard to find, but the game was re-released last year by Lookout Games under the title “Das Grosse Turnier”, so it is making a bit of a comeback… WCTF can actually handle up to 32(!) players—though I’ve never played with more than 12. Each player takes “ownership” of one or more national soccer teams as they play in the World Cup Tournament or the Olympic Tournament. The board has a depiction of the entire tournament, and on each turn, players play two cards to the board: one in the group phase and one in the knockout stage. The game gives you some control over the success of your teams, but not a great deal. In the end, the game is more of an experience/ride, but it’s always lots of fun. You can always tell when people are playing due to the groans or cheers derived from a well-timed “3 Goal” card.
Honorable Mention
1. Attribut
Attribut is a fun real-time word-matching game. However, it’s a bit of a chore to play FTF as the scoring resolution can be fiddly. On BSW, it’s a rollicking 30 minutes of fun with multiple sets of words to play with. The computer takes care of all of the busywork, and the players can spend their time chatting and LOLing. If you haven’t played a game online with the adult wordset, I highly recommend it!
2. Diamant
Another entry-level game that handles up to eight. This would have previously been in the top 5, but I’ve kinda burnt out on it because it got played so much when it first came out.
3. Thingamajig
Thingamajig is another great word game that can be played in a larger group. There is an electronic widget that spits out a word. The active player must give a description or definition of that word trying to get as many people as possible to guess that word. The player will get one point for each player that guesses the right word. However, if every other player guesses the word, the active player gets nothing. The reason why Thingamajig isn’t in the Top 5 is that it needs to be played with the right group (IMHO). Sometimes it’s a blast and other times it feels like a chore—and unfortunately, I’m not sure how to judge that until you get started. Also, heaven forbid if you end up playing this with an Aussie… The “Screw the Aussie” variant is a blast to play, but it does kind of break the game!
4. Würfel Bingo
This is a recently discovered game for me which is very similar to Take It Easy but it uses dice instead of tiles drawn from a bag. It can be essentially be played with any number of people, but the game itself only comes with boards for four players. Ward Batty has come up with a nice paper version of the board which we have used when we have more than four.
5. The World Cup Game
Another soccer game which can take up to 32 players! This one is a bit more complicated (and longer time-wise) than WCTF so it takes a backseat. However, it’s still fun to play, and this one may gain further plays as there are expansions coming out for this one allowing you to replay different World Cup Tournaments. For true soccer fans, the historical replay aspect may be a real plus.
Age of Steam Variant: Netherlands
See above as this variant happens to also make it into the overall Top 5 for this number!
Games I Avoid
1. Apples to Apples
I’ve just never liked this game. It’s never been fun, and it’s always seemed like a popularity contest in the end.
2. Bang!
Any game where a player can be eliminated before he even gets a turn doesn’t deserve to be played IMHO.
3. Diplomacy
I’ve been in one too many games of Diplomacy where there were hard feelings after the game. This is one of the games that pushed me towards the Euros.
4. Extraordinary Adventures of Baron Munchausen
A game certainly meant for groups as it’s about storytelling, though again, it’s really more an activity than a game. But it’s just not for me as I’ve never found it to be that much fun.
5. Werewolf
Perhaps my least favorite game ever. I’ve never enjoyed the constant meaningless discussion which usually turns out to be a popularity contest (where the best liked players or those who tell the funniest stories tend to stick around). I know that there are plenty of people that live for late night games of Werewolf, and I’m comfortable with the fact that I’m not one of them. In fact, I’d rather not game than play Werewolf!
So what did I miss?
Until your next appointment,
The Gaming Doctor
Comments:
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Shadows over Camelot
Peace Posted by Brent Lloyd on Jan 16, 2008 at 01:54 AM | #
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RoboRally
Posted by Håkan König on Jan 16, 2008 at 02:12 AM | #
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> Games I Avoid
> So what did I miss?
Worthy of mention:
And a couple I’ll throw in, even though I don’t like them:
Posted by Curt Carpenter on Jan 16, 2008 at 02:48 AM | #
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Razzia Posted by Simon Johnston on Jan 16, 2008 at 05:54 AM | #
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> Razzia
Posted by Curt Carpenter on Jan 16, 2008 at 06:27 AM | #
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Finally someone said it: not everyone enjoys playing Werewolf--unless you’re a politician or student of the mob mentality. I must admit, the first time I was introduced to it (called “Mafia” in Germany) by the youth group, it made for an entertaining evening, but the “replayability” just isn’t there for me. Of course, this could mean a mob hit or werewolf attack for both of us tonight, Dale, while the rest of the village sleeps… Oh, and don’t forget Frank’s Zoo--best climbing game for 7 players (I don’t think the Great Dalmuti handles that many?) Posted by Jeff Allers on Jan 16, 2008 at 07:54 AM | #
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Breaking Away.
Posted by Valerie Putman on Jan 16, 2008 at 07:55 AM | #
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Good article Dale. But Diplomacy is a great game! And Diamant shouldn’t slide to honorable mention just because YOU have played too many times. : ) I totally agree about Apples to Apples, however. I’m with the readers. My picks:
Shadows over Camelot
Posted by Ryan Bretsch on Jan 16, 2008 at 08:36 AM | #
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To reply to the comments above… First, when composing the list, I had to somehow limit it or else I’d be here forever (and even longer when I got down to 4P and 3P games!)—so, the lists above simply represent my choices which are clearly influenced by the gamers that I play with regularly. My guess is that if I re-did these lists next year, there would be a fair amount of turnover. 1. Shadows over Camelot - Ugh. I generally don’t like cooperative or semi-cooperative games. Lord of the Rings also falls into this trashbin. 2. Formula De is very close to making the Honorable Mention list. But I haven’t played it in 3 or 4 years now, so that hurt its chances. 3. Kill Doctor Lucky - The game is brilliant—until the last few rounds where the game devolves into the “The player before me did what he could to stop me from winning, and now I have to do what I can to stop the next player from winning...” etc 4. Robo-Rally - Takes too long with that many people for my tastes 5. Struggle of Empires - surprisingly, though Age of Steam is one of my two favorite games EVAR, I’m not hot on a lot of the other Warfrog releases. I’ve honestly got no more interest in playing SoE. It’s just not for me. 6. Citadels - takes too long with 7! 7. 6 Nimmt! - This has never felt like a game to me, especially with 7. Posted by Dale Yu on Jan 16, 2008 at 08:49 AM | #
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BTW, I have no idea how you can approach this with topic for games with fewer players than 7, as the number of great games explodes, even at 6. This has been the topic of countless geeklists and forums discussions. You planning on limiting your list of games you like with 4 or 5 players to five games each? hehe Posted by Curt Carpenter on Jan 16, 2008 at 08:56 AM | #
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Dale:
Nice list. Of the games I’ve played that you mention, I’m pretty much in agreement, both the positive and the negative. Two very small quibbles: I’d also elevate Diamant from the honorable mention list, and I’ve come to prefer The World Cup Game over World Cup Tournament Football (the newer game having more tournament options and more open information, and it scales better from 3 players up,
Posted by Bob Scherer-Hoock on Jan 16, 2008 at 09:25 AM | #
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I also really like games for larger numbers that allow players to come or go. It helps make the start of game night or the end of game night a more fluid process. Games like Ricochet Robot or Set come to mind. Posted by Valerie Putman on Jan 16, 2008 at 09:26 AM | #
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>> Razzia > Razzia (like Ra) only goes to 5. Actually, Razzia goes to 8. (Razzia is the Stefan Dorra game; Razzia! is the Reiner Knizia game.) My favorites for 7:
6-Tage Rennen
Posted by Joe Huber on Jan 16, 2008 at 09:50 AM | #
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Joe & Bob - 6-Tage Rennen didn’t make the list because I don’t own it, and as a result, I don’t play it much… (maybe only twice in the last 5 years!) Carabande/PitchCar just doesn’t do it for me in large groups… Val - It’s hard to find games that are good that allow for people to come and go. I tend towards shorter games (Tsuro for example) if I’m going to be in a situation with people coming and going… Another alternative is a game where someone else could take over another player’s position midway (Diamant, Formula De, etc) Dale Posted by Dale Yu on Jan 16, 2008 at 09:59 AM | #
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The Winner of the 1986 Spiel des Jahres, Heimlich & Co. (reprinted as Top Secret Spies from RGG), plays with seven. Posted by Tim Harrison on Jan 16, 2008 at 10:08 AM | #
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Of the games not already mentioned: Coyote is probably my favorite seven-player game, even though it only comes with components for six! (Just have someone use a handkerchief around their head to hold the card.) It’s a bluffing game even I can appreciate, because there’s so much information (as opposed to something like Liar’s Dice). It’s great when you see the table tacitly setting up one player and even better if you can sniff out the group bluff! The newer version, Pow Wow, has equipment for up to eight, but I understand the card mix isn’t as interesting. Haste Worte is another great game for 7 or 8. The ending can get a bit crowded, but it certainly works for those numbers. The real problem is finding a translated set of cards. Why there hasn’t been an English remake of this is beyond me; I think it would do great in the party-mad U.S. Games to avoid with 7: Bohnanza (not awful, but too long, with too little control--I much prefer playing with 5); Citadels (Ack! Too slow doesn’t cover it nearly enough--more like glacial!); and 6 Nimmt! (Utter chaos with this number). Truly the best game for 7 is the 4-3 split. With so many great 3-player games available now, we usually don’t even consider all playing together. Posted by Larry Levy on Jan 16, 2008 at 10:55 AM | #
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Pit is a pretty crazy “filler” for 7 but I prefer to not play a full game as I’d rather dig into something deeper. Bohnanza Even Charades (or playdough “pictionary") is a good group game at times. I also can’t stand Diplomacy, I’ll back you on that one. Apples to Apples can be funny, but it isn’t all that much of a game. I think with seven players (more so than games with fewer players) the group dynamics strongly dictate how much I’d enjoy playing a particular game. If a group can play quickly, I’d play Bang! with 7 players. But make it a slow, thoughtful, over-analyzing group and that would be just painful. Posted by Matt J. Carlson on Jan 16, 2008 at 11:08 AM | #
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I’ve played Coyote with 7 before as well--by wearing a baseball cap backwards (only works with caps that have the adjustable bands on them, of course). Great bluffing party game, and everyone laughs just seeing each other with headbands on.
Posted by Jeff Allers on Jan 16, 2008 at 11:30 AM | #
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Just one question - How is Apples to Apples a popularity contest if the judging is blind? I don’t like the game all that much, truth be told, but it never struck me as a popularity contest. Just wondering… Posted by Christopher Bartlett on Jan 16, 2008 at 11:39 AM | #
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Wits & Wagers plays with 7 or fewer. More if you play in teams. Posted by William Anderson on Jan 16, 2008 at 06:04 PM | #
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Nottingham, one of my favorite recent Uwe Rosenberg games, works well with seven as each turn is fairly quick. Bang! is usually quick enough that the elimination factor does not annoy. We used to play this as a game night closer, so folks were free to go when they were done anyway. :) And certainly, if you have the time, TI3 and Arkham Horror are both great games to play with seven or more. Posted by Kevin Bender on Jan 21, 2008 at 02:29 PM | #
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