I also enjoy playing children’s games, although I do ont yet have any children of my own (twin boys on the way, though!)
I really appreciate a well-designed children’s game, and, of course, the bits from Selecta, Zoch, Haba and Drei Magier are truly amazing.
My two nieces in the USA get board games from Uncle Jeff in Germany every year!
Even though many of the games are expensive, Ravensburger and Haba have some really nice small-box games that are more affordable and good to take along on family trips.

There is definitely a different circle for children’s games in the US that does not fully cross our “hobbyist” circle of games.  Take a look at the iparenting site ( http://iparentingmediaawards.com/winners/12/Toys_Games.php )
or just read the criticisms of ChiTag ( http://www.chitag.com/ ) on BGG http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/51563?sk=chitag from folks that want it to be less focuses on children’s games and more focused on hobby games.

Always good to hear about quality children’s games.  I have a few, but most aren’t sold in most local gaming stores, so it is difficult to discover them.

I was just visiting a game store while at the WBC with a group of gamers, and one of them was looking for a game for his kid.  He picked up Kids of Catan, and clearly, the price was an issue.  It’s one thing to spend $50 (or whatever it was) for a game you know you are going to take care of.  It’s another to spend it on a game that you expect to get trashed.

One real world example doesn’t really support any particular conclusion except to demonstrate that it can be a real issue.

Agreed.  But it sure would be great if the people who are buying kids games (nudge, nudge, Dale) would rate them on BGG so that other parents had more information on which ones to invest in.  (I mention this because I haven’t heard positive feedback about Kids Catan).  If you don’t want to muck up your collection and ratings with a bunch of kids games, parents could create BGG accounts for their kids, enter the kids games in that account, and rate the games based on how much the kids actually like them.  I’m sure some of the mass market games are good too (since I know that Dale’s brother, Brian Yu, designed many of them, I shouldn’t knock them completely), but it sure would be nice if others who have already bought them would rate them so I know which ones to buy for birthday presents and which ones to pass on.  As for the attitude that BGG should be for adult hobby games only, I am surprised.  Where is the next generation of adult hobby gamers supposed to come from?

Well, just so you know, I’ll be discussing children’s games here and there on my column… As to why I don’t use BGG, it’s because I don’t have time.  I frankly do not have the Type A tendencies to spend the massive amount of time it would take to catalog my 900+ games in BGG, much less the time it takes to rate them!  So, Valerie, I guess you’ll just have to ask me.  Or read my column.  <g> Dale

There are four factors that I see that make buying children’s games quite different from adults’ games, even if all children’s game play is supervised so that pieces are never lost or squashed.

1. Expected duration of use
I’d expect a children’s game to be used for at most 2-3 years per child, whereas games for adults don’t come with that built-in expiry time.

2. Longer shelf-life
If we accept a 2-3 year window for each game, the ‘newness’ of a game becomes less relevant, as any given game is new to 1/3 of its target audience in any one year. The “Essen factor” - or the need to buy the newest game - becomes less of an issue when buyers take each game in the context of ALL available games, as opposed to the latest releases.

3. Different market
What is the percentage of game buyers in a game group? Maybe 15%? I find that most families have “some” children’s ganes - far more than have gamers’ games (or any boardgames, for that matter) - but fewer by far have LOTS of games. And each family tends to have the same games - because there are fewer opportunities to try the games out before committing to a purchase (look at the relative market penetration of Blokus, which has demonstration copies readily available in the shops). I suspect, sadly, that the market for quality children’s games is more limited than the market for quality adults’ games (being primarily people who are both gamers and parents). We’ve always found that gifts of games are gratefully received by parents as well as children, often with a comment that they’d not seen that game before or “where do you get great games like that?”

Just out of interest, I looked at the dates of the games we’ve bought for Otto (3) and Biggie (8 today) in the past year or so:
Apples to Apples Junior - 2001
I have - 2004 (and should be burned rather than bought - but that’s another story)
Catch the Match - 2001
Frog Juice - 1995
Piggy Back - 2000
Go away monster - 2001
Die Nacht der Magier - 2005
Tier auf Tier - 2005
Dancing Eggs - 2003
Make ‘n’ Break - 2004
Gulo Gulo - 2003
Dawn Under - 2004
Pick Picknic - 2001

so only 2 games out of 13 that might be relevant to this year’s awards. We’ve not been stingy with our game purchases, but we’ve bought games over a much wider range of publication years than we probably would for ourselves.

One final factor is

4. Kids also playing ‘adult’/’family’ games
Our 8 year old loves San Juan, 6 nimmt, Circus Flohcati, Yinsh, Around the World in 80 days, Transamerica, Ticket to Ride, Formula De, Pirate’s Cove, Balloon Cup, Lost Cities, Diamant (on BSW - under strict supervision), Heckmeck/Pickomino (ditto). Our 3 year old wants to play Dominoes or “The game with colours” (Ingenious). Children’s games make up just one part of their gaming experience.

I think this is an important issue, and I would love to see more exposure for good children’s games, both to gamers and to the general public. But it’s important to recognise that buying games for kids can be quite different than buying the best of Essen for yourself or for a favourite adult.

One more thing, echoing Tom’s comment earlier - sometimes price *is* an issue. (I hope this doesn’t sound like I’m being defensive, because I don’t *feel* that way, but just wanted to recognise that this is an issue too.)

I spend a lot more on my kids than I do on myself, with a whole new wardrobe of clothes needed for each of them every season (than goodness Otto can wear the still-immaculate clothes that Biggie has outgrown), books, proper shoes for developing feet, $12,000 a year childcare (that’s just for the little one), school and preschool contributions and donations, birthday parties, outings and activities - sometimes there’s a choice of who or what to spend that discretionary $50 or $100 on. And sometimes - just sometimes - I win :)

Then, I do the “neener neener, Mummy has a new game” dance. It’s not pretty, but it’s fun.

Dale,

You don’t need Type A tendencies.  I am fairly Type B, myself.  OCD, on the other hand, is quite useful.

-MMM

I’m less impressed with Kids of Catan the game than the pieces, which are pretty impressive.  I’d much rather play Chicken Cha Cha Cha, but if your kids are too young to do memory games, Kids of Catan is ok for the VERY early age (just after you convince them not to eat the pieces and just before they make real decisions).  My friend with 4-5 yr olds says Kids of Catan was a pretty good hit.  I have to admit that those pricey kids games do have some very nice pieces and very well may last to being used with Grandchildren…

As Melissa pointed out, I think that the slightly older kids (anywhere from 6 and up, depending on skill development) could probably be just as happy with adult games, perhaps with modified rules.  And I can see that games for children 2 - 5 would be viewed as having a very short shelf life.  I admit, if I had kids and I had to choose between spending $40 on a game I think I’ll be playing for 10 years and a game I think my kids will be playing for 3 years, I would likely win too.  But some of the designer games are so good that I also see them as games that I will play when it’s late at night and I want something light.  I also see them as investments for generations to come.

You would likely be able to resell children’s games on the Geek with a fair return on your original cost, assuming all the pieces are present and intact. After all, if price is a concern for you, it’s likely a concern for others and they’ll be happy to take a slightly used copy off your hands.

Well, all the comments here have made me re-think my writing muse… Keep your eyes peeled for a little bit of info on kids games each Wednesday in my column!